Wrong Ammo

Proofing your loaded ammuntion.
littleloon
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Re: Wrong Ammo

Post by littleloon »

Surprised top strap didn't leave with cylinder. May have been a barrel blockage to cause this much damage. Saw a 357 in similar shape in a smith but without top strap, believed a triple charge. Lucky no one hurt in either case. Littleloon
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Re: Wrong Ammo

Post by RBHarter »

Here's a little something.
On the left a 223/556 on the right the same steel cased fired in a 6.8 Rem. The most likely cause is same magazines in a switched upper AR. Although it is a greater cartridge example it is 2 rifle cartridges that operate around 60k with bullets of 224 and 277,vs 429 and 452 at 30k and 18 k . All you get with this is the warm "wth" was I thinking " feeling.
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Re: Wrong Ammo

Post by ljnowel »

RBHarter wrote:Here's a little something.
On the left a 223/556 on the right the same steel cased fired in a 6.8 Rem. The most likely cause is same magazines in a switched upper AR. Although it is a greater cartridge example it is 2 rifle cartridges that operate around 60k with bullets of 224 and 277,vs 429 and 452 at 30k and 18 k . All you get with this is the warm "wth" was I thinking " feeling.
In the original post there wouldn't have been the opportunity for the pressure to build to that level. With no case support the brass would have ruptured and vented and the bullet wouldn't have sealed to the bore. Two avenues of pressure escape without restriction means no over pressure situation. Couple that with the fact that the gun could withstand 44 mag pressures anyway means that there was something else at play here.
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Re: Wrong Ammo

Post by RBHarter »

I don't have pics of the 9x19 in a 9x18 Mak or the 44-40 in a 45. I fully concur with the idea that the mag would not have opened up an RBH unless there were another issue at hand.
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Re: Wrong Ammo

Post by larryw »

Yea, Clean shear of the both walls on the middle chamber,
front to back??? There is something else going on here???
Sure would like to know what it is???
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Re: Wrong Ammo

Post by Steve »

larryw wrote:Yea, Clean shear of the both walls on the middle chamber,
front to back??? There is something else going on here???
Sure would like to know what it is???
I don't know what it could be other than maybe some bad steel, or the fact that it had been fired a lot for years.

I am going to continue showing it to my classes with the same info I gave in the opening of this thread. And tell them to make sure they have the correct ammo. I don't want to bog them down with a lot of what ifs or maybes. Just the facts as I know them.
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Re: Wrong Ammo

Post by larryw »

Good idea Steve, No sense giving them more to process than they need.
If that visual doesn't wake 'em up & drive home the point, nothing will!!

I saw an old model 29 a couple weeks ago that had come apart like that,
top strap & all, the story was, the guy shoots "nothing" but lead, the 29
was shaving bad so he switched to FMJ, said he thought that would stop
the leading??? (I know??) Well, it stopped something, 2nd round, parts launch.
Knowing the guy, we all figured he had a "way" over charge of 110 & someone
floated the idea that "maybe" the S&W being so bad out of time, that the FMJ
stopped things up, or slowed them down enough to cause the failure. I will say
this, I went to school with this guy many many moons ago, & to be nice,
all his ducks ain't on the same pond!! Squibs all over the place, over charges,
I don't know how many times? No one will shoot with this guy let alone be
around him at all anymore????? Could have happened like that????????????????
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Re: Wrong Ammo

Post by Steve »

larryw wrote:Good idea Steve, No sense giving them more to process than they need.
If that visual doesn't wake 'em up & drive home the point, nothing will!!

I saw an old model 29 a couple weeks ago that had come apart like that,
top strap & all, the story was, the guy shoots "nothing" but lead, the 29
was shaving bad so he switched to FMJ, said he thought that would stop
the leading??? (I know??) Well, it stopped something, 2nd round, parts launch.
Knowing the guy, we all figured he had a "way" over charge of 110 & someone
floated the idea that "maybe" the S&W being so bad out of time, that the FMJ
stopped things up, or slowed them down enough to cause the failure. I will say
this, I went to school with this guy many many moons ago, & to be nice,
all his ducks ain't on the same pond!! Squibs all over the place, over charges,
I don't know how many times? No one will shoot with this guy let alone be
around him at all anymore????? Could have happened like that????????????????
Your mention of lead gets me to thinking about this one Larry. This pistol had mostly lead shot through it and cleaning was not a regular happening. So maybe heavy leading contributed along with the factory mag jacketed load.
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Re: Wrong Ammo

Post by larryw »

When you break it down, it is possible??? Being so far out of time it will barely ignite the primer,
Badly shaving lead, could have slowed a Jacketed down enough to plug up the works?
Case head jammed into the recoil plate, bullet lodged in the Cyl throat, Big pressure could
have deformed bullet enough to seal off throat? Now you have a pipe bomb in that cyl???
That's the only thing we could come up with on the S&W?????
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Re: Wrong Ammo

Post by ljnowel »

larryw wrote:When you break it down, it is possible??? Being so far out of time it will barely ignite the primer,
Badly shaving lead, could have slowed a Jacketed down enough to plug up the works?
Case head jammed into the recoil plate, bullet lodged in the Cyl throat, Big pressure could
have deformed bullet enough to seal off throat? Now you have a pipe bomb in that cyl???
That's the only thing we could come up with on the S&W?????
it would have to be some serious leading to stop a .429" jacketed slug from making it down a .451" barrel.

I still think there as a 45 bullet stuck in a barrel or something else happening. I stand by the analysis that a 44 mag could not have done this. There would be no opportunity for the pressure to build.
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